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Offline goldnugget01

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My Rant re recovery
« on: April 28, 2016, 19:15 »
I just heard second hand about someone in the Hervey Bay area that called someone in to help find an item of jewellery.  It was discussed on FB on thread that has since been deleted 'as the matter has been referred to the police' so didn't get a chance to see it in person.
Apparently someone lost something, found someone online offering a detecting service (had a look on gumtree, there used to be someone in the region, Maryborough I think but didn't spot the ad tonight when I looked, don't know if it was them) so they came in and gave the male money for showing up.  After a couple of hours the people that called him in noticed he found something and put in his pocket, when questioned he admitted he found it and then wanted more money from them before he would give it back.  Naturally the locals on FB went nuts about it before the post was deleted. I don't know whether the guy has kept the piece hostage or whether they got the item back.
In my view, if this is what happened, and you are a member here, you have some explaining to do.  If you still have the item, the police will charge you and you have also added a target to the rest of us in the bay area that do the right thing by people. 
Personally I have been involved in a few recoveries but have NEVER asked for a cent up front nor have I actually set any figure for my services.  I have always left it open to the potential owner to give a reward IF the item was found and IF they choose to pay me anything at all. 
I am tempted, as a result of the actions of this person to do my own ads for recoveries and make MY TERMS clear and up front which means that the guy involved in this caper is unlikely to get another recovery job again in this region.  We work hard in the local area to make sure we don't ruffle feathers as we go about our hobby and don't need cowboys coming in ruining it for everyone. 
For now, rant over.
  • Detector(s) owned/used: ML Explorer SE - std DD coil & ML x-terra 70. Coils: std concentric, 10x5 18.75DD, 15" 18.75DD
  • Oldest find: 1912 threepence...make that an 1899 Penny..make that an 1861? German 4 Pfennige. A suss looking (but confirmed) 1830-1837 half crown
Every day is 'Clean Up Australia Day' when you go detecting.

Offline AngerManagement

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #1 on: April 28, 2016, 20:23 »
DITTO  enough said
  • Detector(s) owned/used: excal 1000, x-pointer, 705 ,Gamma 6000 & CTX3030
  • Oldest find: ME
So can I use braid and how tight should the drag be set  when Sand Fishing...

Offline Ramjet

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2016, 12:06 »
It's the 1% who do that type of crap that give us a bad reputation. Piece of.......
  • Detector(s) owned/used: XP Deus, Garrett At Pro, Ace 250. CTX 3030. Aldi for the grandkids and an old mid 70's wall hanger.
  • Oldest find: 1807 George III Halfpenny and 1806 or 07 Large penny. Oldest silver 1854 threepence.
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Offline lazyaussie

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2016, 20:03 »
problem with FB rants is they are very one sided & the truth is quite often covered over to make the poster look better, so unless I know both sides of the story I tend to keep outta stuff like this :)  
  • Detector(s) owned/used: garrett AT pro, garrett ace 250, garrett pro pointer, garrett sea hunter, whites dual field,
  • Oldest find: 1797 cartwheel penny x 2
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Offline goldnugget01

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2016, 23:36 »
I don't know how there can be any misunderstanding based on what I wrote and where the rights of the owner of the item lay.  The guy was paid when he turned up and then hustled the people to get their item back.  They didn't know each other prior to the job so it would have been a straight forward arrangement.  The poster went onto a local FB group to warn others about their practices.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2016, 23:38 by goldnugget01 »
  • Detector(s) owned/used: ML Explorer SE - std DD coil & ML x-terra 70. Coils: std concentric, 10x5 18.75DD, 15" 18.75DD
  • Oldest find: 1912 threepence...make that an 1899 Penny..make that an 1861? German 4 Pfennige. A suss looking (but confirmed) 1830-1837 half crown
Every day is 'Clean Up Australia Day' when you go detecting.

Offline Adrian ss

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2016, 10:28 »
Stealing By finding is a very real law.
In this case if the finder is known to have the item and was hanging out for more cash, then he can be charged with Stealing By Finding and maybe extortion
  • Detector(s) owned/used: Sea Hunter MK II, Safari, SDC 2300, 6000DI SL ,BHID,ML Stirling,GS 15000, Sov XS, Lobo ST, relic M 7,Fisher 553D & 555D,CX4PI,Infinium,Spectrum XLT.6000D,6000DI S 3, Gold Spear, Scorpion, CXII & CXIII,Pro Scan,Some Home Built VLFs & PIs and some others.
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Offline lazyaussie

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2016, 12:36 »
not having a go at ya mate :)  just my opinion on FB rants as I'm quite distrustful of stuff unless I hear or have the full info from both party's, just the way I am ;D .
yes if Mr detectorist was payed for the job up front then demanded more cash that's bad form, just a few red flags pop up on this for me.
lazy 
 
  • Detector(s) owned/used: garrett AT pro, garrett ace 250, garrett pro pointer, garrett sea hunter, whites dual field,
  • Oldest find: 1797 cartwheel penny x 2
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Offline goldnugget01

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2016, 14:28 »
not having a go at ya mate :)  just my opinion on FB rants as I'm quite distrustful of stuff unless I hear or have the full info from both party's, just the way I am ;D .
yes if Mr detectorist was payed for the job up front then demanded more cash that's bad form, just a few red flags pop up on this for me.
lazy
 

All good and I get it.

The FB group is a strictly controlled local group called Brick Bats and Bouquets which allows people to post a good thing or a bad thing about someone, business or experience but if its a bad thing you cant name the person or business concerned so it cant be used to directly attack someone out of spite like many other FB pages.   The info that I had (from my own missus, who is in the loop about how anything to do with detecting goes) is what I based the details of this post on who was the one following (and commented on) the thread.

I know most people do the right thing and I have no issue in people trying to recoup some $$$ in the course of their hobby or for their services but draw the line at holding any item for ransom particularly after they had already paid up front for their time (as mentioned in the original post) 'if this is what happened'. But I also know that there are a lot of cowboys out there with no morals that wouldn't think twice in doing the wrong thing in this hobby.

The post is more of a 'Heads Up' that there are people out there doing this sort of thing and if they do frequent this and other Detecting Forums that this sort of behaviour is not acceptable and gives the rest of us a bad name.
  • Detector(s) owned/used: ML Explorer SE - std DD coil & ML x-terra 70. Coils: std concentric, 10x5 18.75DD, 15" 18.75DD
  • Oldest find: 1912 threepence...make that an 1899 Penny..make that an 1861? German 4 Pfennige. A suss looking (but confirmed) 1830-1837 half crown
Every day is 'Clean Up Australia Day' when you go detecting.

Offline Skexis

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2016, 15:14 »
Stealing By finding is a very real law.
Indeed, and we are all guilty. In all honesty has anyone here ever handed a find in to the police and then claimed it after the requisite number of days? What about all the jewellery members have found on the beaches. Was any of it reported/handed in?
  • Detector(s) owned/used: Current: Tesoro Sand Shark, Minelab Sovereign GT, Minelab Xterra 70, Garrett AT Pro, Garrett ProPointer. Retired: Minelab Xterra 305, Tesoro Cibola.
  • Oldest find: 1916 Sixpence


Offline AngerManagement

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2016, 15:51 »
I hand stuff over all the time... 99.8% of the stuff I get back... Wallets and Credit Cards / Drivers licenses = never received back ;-)

But like many things it comes back to if the item can be identified...  Even the police do not want to be annoyed with things that can not be identified...   No use handing over a lost $2 coin  or a plain gold or silver band..

And you need to be able to make the call as to Abandoned Vs Lost .

Years ago, hand stuff to the police or Lost property at some places and it vanished :-(

Today the Police have a paper trail and have to have at least 2 if not 3 signatures if an item is claimed.  Thus more chance of the real owner getting it OR being returned to you.  Do not hand over to Lost Property departments.

PS.  Even after it is returned to you by the police; if the real owner comes forward, they still have a claim on the item but they have to pay compensation AND your not subject to a charge of theft by finding..
« Last Edit: May 01, 2016, 16:13 by AngerManagement »
  • Detector(s) owned/used: excal 1000, x-pointer, 705 ,Gamma 6000 & CTX3030
  • Oldest find: ME
So can I use braid and how tight should the drag be set  when Sand Fishing...

Offline Skexis

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2016, 16:59 »
To clarify, I was referring to detecting finds rather than wallets etc. I'm a public transport worker and get at least one wallet or purse per fortnight plus innumerable phones, all of which have made it back to their owners. 
  • Detector(s) owned/used: Current: Tesoro Sand Shark, Minelab Sovereign GT, Minelab Xterra 70, Garrett AT Pro, Garrett ProPointer. Retired: Minelab Xterra 305, Tesoro Cibola.
  • Oldest find: 1916 Sixpence

Offline AngerManagement

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2016, 17:38 »
To clarify, I was referring to detecting finds rather than wallets etc. I'm a public transport worker and get at least one wallet or purse per fortnight plus innumerable phones, all of which have made it back to their owners.

My finds are detecting finds.. And yes, wallets and credit cards etc are items I find when detecting AND the items that the police do not hand back... All the Rings and other stuff I have handed in have been returned to me...

Yet I have handed over items to other lost property places and directed owners there, only to find that it is missing or been collected by some one else.   So unless the Lost property place is run/managed correctly, I only hand back to the police.

I van park I detect on occasions has a lost register and the owner and I go over it and compare my finds to the list. Anything that is not on his list / but could be identified goes to the police.  And then I report back to him...

Some of the people that stay at his park, have returned and thanked him for the return of lost property.

A Win for him and a Win for me... And a happy owner...
  • Detector(s) owned/used: excal 1000, x-pointer, 705 ,Gamma 6000 & CTX3030
  • Oldest find: ME
So can I use braid and how tight should the drag be set  when Sand Fishing...

Offline Andy1918

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2016, 17:52 »
But like many things it comes back to if the item can be identified...  Even the police do not want to be annoyed with things that can not be identified...   No use handing over a lost $2 coin  or a plain gold or silver band..

I think that many of us are far too pragmatic to take unidentifiable items (as AngerManagement has mentioned above) to the police as we pay them to do more important things than to log finds that would be near impossible to find the owner. Most of the finds really aren't that valuable, and the old items are long gone and forgotten.

Something truly of value, or where an owner would be looking for a returned item (eg wallet, credit cards etc), then of course it should go to the police.
  • Detector(s) owned/used: Minelab X-Terra 305, Minelab Excalibur II, Minelab Pro Find-25
  • Oldest find: Queen Victoria 1881 Half Penny
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Offline goldnugget01

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2017, 16:58 »
This is an old post but kind of related to what I am about to say.
Another FB post on a local 'brickbats and bouquets' rants site has exposed another (possibly the same detectorist involved) incident.  A couple lost an expensive ring on the beach, called a guy in after posting looking for someone with a detector.  The guy comes in with his mate (I suspect I have seen these guys on the beaches myself), gets his $80 fee for turning up, detects the area picks up a few things and puts them straight into his finds bag, after a little while the response is 'Nope found nothing' the couple get a little suss, he wont show what he has found and they demand he empties his finds bag at which he flatly refuses, tells them to get stuffed and gives them their $80 back.......
........Me? I reckon they've taken off with the ring.  Again, luckily, others have pointed me out as one of the good guys since I dont charge people for turning up, or even finding (I let them decide if they want to pay me and what they can afford).  If this dick is reading these forums, you are a complete f/wit and a flat out thief.  These people will be going to the police with all the details they have on you as well as going to all the local pawnbrokers and if you are reading this and want to face off, I'll be happy to do that next time we cross paths you maggot. The town has enough junkies preying on locals and visitors, your act has just friggin topped me off, You are done.
  • Detector(s) owned/used: ML Explorer SE - std DD coil & ML x-terra 70. Coils: std concentric, 10x5 18.75DD, 15" 18.75DD
  • Oldest find: 1912 threepence...make that an 1899 Penny..make that an 1861? German 4 Pfennige. A suss looking (but confirmed) 1830-1837 half crown
Every day is 'Clean Up Australia Day' when you go detecting.

Offline BrisGazza

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2017, 17:30 »
I personally think it is rude to charge to find something . If it was me & i found what was lost then i would just give it back . It would be an excuse to go doing what i like doing . Also would be good PR for our Hobby . If the owner offered a small amount to help pay for fuel then ok , fair enough , but to take advantage of people shows how greedy some are ,  Gazza .
  • Detector(s) owned/used: Garrett A T Pro International , Garrett Pinpointer
  • Oldest find: 1797 Cartwheel Penny - 1881 Half Sovereign
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Offline douglas

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2017, 18:26 »
Bad form indeed, but this hobby is popular at the moment and a lot don't seem to care, went for a walk the other day and came across about 50 of these full cut plugs all dead ready to be sucked up into the next cut with the mower

Offline pug patrol

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #16 on: May 07, 2017, 20:30 »
My wife and I were just discussing tonight about the older you get the more tossers you encounter through life.
Beginning to wonder if I'm the only morally sane person at the moment.

Offline AngerManagement

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #17 on: May 07, 2017, 20:46 »
For the owners... I do hope they go to the police and I would laugh to see the guys; when the police might wish to search and look for stolen property...  "Where is the recipe for all those rings in that display case ?  "
Problem is that the BAD wrap, means many on the beaches see a person with a Detector and think we are all from the same cut...
Short sighted pigs...
  • Detector(s) owned/used: excal 1000, x-pointer, 705 ,Gamma 6000 & CTX3030
  • Oldest find: ME
So can I use braid and how tight should the drag be set  when Sand Fishing...

Offline goldnugget01

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #18 on: May 07, 2017, 21:27 »
My wife and I were just discussing tonight about the older you get the more tossers you encounter through life.
Beginning to wonder if I'm the only morally sane person at the moment.

I wasn't sure if it is my age, or just sick and tired of the cesspool this place is becoming...its getting crazy out there.  The legal system (known as the 'criminal justice system' here in Qld) seems to be ensuring there is justice for the criminals more and more each day. Starting to feel like a mug for doing the right thing for the last 45 years of my life and not getting anywhere when there are pricks out there stealing, lying and cheating and putting the heavy on people and getting away with it (whether they are charged or not).

I'm sure I used to be a nicer person not long ago, guess I'm just all out of F%^ks to give any more.

Oh well....I guess thats my rant for now......cheers all.


 
  • Detector(s) owned/used: ML Explorer SE - std DD coil & ML x-terra 70. Coils: std concentric, 10x5 18.75DD, 15" 18.75DD
  • Oldest find: 1912 threepence...make that an 1899 Penny..make that an 1861? German 4 Pfennige. A suss looking (but confirmed) 1830-1837 half crown
Every day is 'Clean Up Australia Day' when you go detecting.

Offline AngerManagement

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2017, 21:39 »
Wait until you get even older...

I would not want to be around in another 30 years....    Picked up some dropped coin for an old dear in a walker at the shops the other day...  She was having issues and her purse dropped...

I was 25M away and people every where... She was ignored....  I got to her and Asked if I could help...  Had I reached for  a coin first..  Who knows what could have happened...  She could have been a Police bait LOL...

PS.  Chewed fingernails and polished tiled floors... Thank the lord for worn grout, otherwise; I could never have picked the 5c and 10c up...

And do not get me started on 2 people in a car at 110 plus in trafic and both on their phones texting ......

  • Detector(s) owned/used: excal 1000, x-pointer, 705 ,Gamma 6000 & CTX3030
  • Oldest find: ME
So can I use braid and how tight should the drag be set  when Sand Fishing...

Offline werewolf

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Re: My Rant re recovery
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2017, 22:14 »
Lots of dickheads in this hobby now unfortunately. Seems to be a growing cult of cowboy night hunters wreaking havoc under the cover of darkness, whilst bragging to their 'bros' live on FB. I live in hope this 'fad' will be over soon and they will move on to other bogan pursuits.

 

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